welcome to the bring intimacy back show we are intimacy is real if you desire to intimately connected with your self your significant other children Family Friends Community and your higher power this show is for you. We explore intimate topics inspiring life stories beer to ality and insightful tips on strengthening relationships this show is hosted by dr. April ever tell those dr. Kelly now let's get this episode of the bringing intimacy back show started because we share with you the secret power to intimacy to create a life you love or love the life you create now here's your host dr. April and co-host dr. Kelly-Ann intimacy back show where intimacy is real yes hi good afternoon dr. Kelly how are you doing I'm doing well I'll let you know I did today what did you do today I did canning you know when you put like you cut up your vegetables

when you steam them in a pot and yeah yes I remember doing that when I was little with my grandma in Charleston South Carolina I miss that the peace and it picks up and then go through the process of canning my niece is named neighbor gave us the tomatoes so I was like hey I'm all to it and it's a process but it's sell healthy you know the saying that touch of being back and eating real food solutely this is some real food I mean I pick them off the vine and I have two quarts of stewed tomatoes and Costa Rica yeah it was a wonderful yes yes yes yes definitely I'm in Costa Rica everything so natural and authentic and the people and the culture

which is better were talking about today cultural intimacy before we get started that I want you I'm let everyone know about my third Egypt is coming out and it's kind of a summer we were talking about today which is improving intimacy with everyday questions cuz even with culture it's everyday you know it's yes especially in our society I mean there's some places in this world where it's like 1% of a different culture or 2% I mean especially where you live in Southwest Florida and I don't know where our guests Michael O'Brien it's from but if it touches our lives in so many different ways so what's important right right especially if we come upon on this upcoming weekend of September 11th I think culture is very important in understanding and being respectful

I'm different cultures yes so before we get into Michael Mike has a great person I'm going to introduce them in the moment but I also want to let our audience to know about our charity at the month which is not mother's home it's an organization that I worked with this Summer that helps young teen mom so if you're interested in that please go to w w r a mother's home. Net will now let me walk to a good friend of mine a colleague someone that I've gotten to know Michael O'Brien welcome Michael is actually a sociologist by Trey and therapist you've been around different cultures and stuff with over 20 years of experience Michael is also a professor and he's working as a professor in Chicago here in Florida that fly you and now congratulations my dog for FGCU

yes definitely a Michaels in our local neck of the woods dr. Kelly I'm in Naples do really beautiful sunny self and Michael and I are we talked to her conversation I'm just about over a year ago maybe 2 years ago about culture and how that impacts expressly where we live in Southwest Florida so yeah so welcome Michael to the show all those different ways in which we find a curry full about the fact that it's in the everyday things in the small thing because that's absolutely what sort of cultural anthropologists believe we don't eat and intimacy the great example of seeing how different cultures do things differently right just how we interact how we hug how we greet each other right what is it's okay and not okay so it's a very in

topic for me personally as well as professionally to Michael we start off by asking you to guess how do you define intimacy today for me it's a feeling okay so you know and given what we do for fussing baby right we're talking a lot about feelings it's about a feeling warm it's about so just hearing the word conduit for me personally a feeling about the closeness it's about warmth it's about connection some of which is private so I'm going to stick with intimacy is about connection and more that's that's my personal definition of how it feels for me and yeah yeah when you and I travel together and we talkin about I'm culture and how that impacts because they each of us have been impacted by culture

and before we even get to culture I'm from a sociologist can you define what culture is so of a particular group so what that means is it's the way we do everything in the way we even approach things and group 2 mean anything because we go in and out of groups right so and if we got me thinking when you were first talking about this show that idea that there's sort of a US culture right there something we consider us culture there's a Norms we have in the culture how we greet each other how we interact but then also with in any place there are many many groups what we would call subcultures right this is the sociological term subculture so you know friends could be a Culture Club you belong to the way we interact professionally with clients is very different as a certain set of ethical standards and guidelines that differs from my personal life

so the entire life was ever given group and that includes the norm the values the interactions and even just how we approach what we do

concise I like it a lot of times people neglect to talk about the subcultures

nns the thing you know what there's always this dominance in a minute for a couple of weeks so see how to come up with your this dominant culture write any country in any group other words the dominant way things are done the main way so we go to a job interview and US culture were probably already Conjuring some images were looking someone straight in the eye with a firm handshake all those sort of things but within any group there are some proofs and we go in and out of the subgroups right so there's not just one sort of okay way of doing things there's multiple ways within each of the groups that we can rest and acting a certain way we meet our friends later were probably acting and looking at the different way right that's an example of subculture

yeah I like how you said there's different ways to do things

yeah and for some people they have a hard time with that especially in today's culture that if you don't do things my way

it's right in and you know I think that's where Ana societal level we get into trouble because people I think I think some people just don't even know what we're talking about right now and I think specifically of that friend reading I was introduced to some of these differences very early on probably unusually early on because I'm Mexican American and we would go visit family you know as a baby and it's a small child and literally the way we would read each other would be different than I would read my American family which is more of that firm handshake hello we always would like sort of embrace each other right if you go to a barber shop a black owned barber shop in Spanish barber shop you'll notice just as well there's a lot more touching than there is in any of the American barber shops that I've gone to in my life

so you'll see much more you know sort of tan clenching as opposed to you know a regular sort of European style handshake more embracing things like that so we really start to see those differences once we open our eyes to them and I think that's that's a good point that you just made we have to be attuned to the fact that there are these differences in order to be able to see them what do you think about that

I I like when you explain about the Norms when you talk about the word norms and even with in today's culture and today's society it's changing whereas we used to hug more and I'm wondering about the cultural intimacy and how it's being impacted and Society with with the pandemic because people aren't hugging and I'm I actually am lecturing in the classroom now and we have to wear masks and some of the the illustrations that I use I'm like okay we're going to do this and then I'll wait we can't do that my whole entire lecturers and I know as a professor you can relate to this both of you Educators it's like the Norms are changing doesn't resonate with me I'm like where do I belong I mean I'm the professor I should be able to communicate this with so much of my communication has relied on Hands On Learning

so if we translate that to what the norm is and cultural intimacy now and how we interact with people weather in a barber shop or somewhere else it's up to you know the first couple months of when I return to the office and maybe Doctor Who can speak to this point to it was tough for me not to shake hands it took several months you know I would you know I decided way of doing this this is you know sort of a subcultural thing I would shake hands with the person off of them water or coffee or something we'll all the sudden peeing on the midst of covid I'm not offering them the hand of a cup of coffee nor am I shaking their hand so I found myself on autopilot often right cuz once we do these things are getting drained and tired of neural Pathways and all that so I would start to like awkwardly reach out and they would in that I would be like what was I supposed to do that and so you know and even asked felt like at least it was the level of closeness when I would Shake somebody's hand in them like

now like you say we're having to keep a distance and it feels it feels awkward at the very least so what are we what are we left with right we're left with communicating with words and their eyes and In some cultures eye contact is considered invasive so he came from Japan to do his PhD at FIU and we have a lot of interesting conversations about this you can imagine because of the difference is like we got to sit and talk about the fastest you know how when you was cultured little more confrontational we might not think we are but yeah we are BOGO stand up to the other person literally and like look him right in the eye right and you know possibly be a little close especially we saw this a lot with confrontation with Corbin in his culture you said to me at his exact words were that you just don't see that you know especially in the

like I respect for Professor or doctor someone you keep a greater distance between the people you're not you know sort of looking them in the eye like that you're so big differences and if you didn't know that it would appear it could appear and he's told me that at times people thought maybe he was standoffish or something like that but it's just his normal just like it was mine I stick my hand out and we can do something that can be disrespectful so how do we as we're at the community coming together me and with different people is masses. How did we figure out what would we do and all that well we come back going to take a short break I want you to think about that and give us some answers and will be back in them

are you going to take a vacation in Paradise station to rekindle the version without the kids a vacation where you can learn how to communicate where you and your partner actually hear each other in the game inside if so vacation counseling is your next vacation fling in Southwest Florida as a perfect option for you and your partner our Retreats are one couple at a time we have a variety of packages available to choose from including virtual Couples Retreat if you and your partner interested in the vacation counseling please visit us at vacation counseling.com for more information on pricing and packages also follow us on Instagram and Facebook to keep track of the latest news stories activities or coupons on vacation counseling and Doctor April's other services we encourage you to sign up to receive a monthly newsletter called in

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welcome back to the bring an intimacy show where intimacy is real tell Michael we were just talking about and we'll talk to Kelly about different norms and culture and how do we connect and what is respectful and not respectful how do we figure all this out many different ways in so many groups and idea that we go in and out of these group tonight any given day right so for those of us and I know doctor April is I'm sure dr. Kelly R22 as well when we go in and out of these groups were aware of those differences right so I think I think I think there's sort of some groups in America who who may be in all countries as well but who aren't as open to seeing these differences okay and we don't have to like it

or dislike it so I want to kind of put that judgment on reserve but just sort of accepting the reality that these differences are there I think are a big step my suggestion is to sort of take a breath when situations literally as as you know I'm mindfulness is one of my Mainstays of my therapeutic interventions so taking a breath observing what's around us we have to have a willingness to see what the other other groups are doing and I have an example when I moved I'm born and raised in Chicago okay so Chicago is the city of big shoulders right people get things done at the very pragmatic City settled by communal settled by digit of people and then German Farmers came and settled areas around Chicago and in Chicago so it's a very sort of correct handshake maybe a hog is how you would greet somebody normally that sort of thing so I want to move to Miami I started getting uncomfortable

off the bat because everybody does this little sort of cheek to cheek kissing in the air right and when I say everybody it really is pretty much everybody like the kutu kisses or three kisses some countries are three kisses and send it to us and for me personally from where I come from that kind of intimate it's a little too intimate for me to just first meet somebody or I met them once and to be kissing them that's right so I did everything I could to resist I mean literally putting physical barriers are times like I stand behind a chair in like waves so I did get

hearing that makes you just a slight bit uncomfortable

really I stopped by Norah my Norm is dead firm handshake or a Chicago Hadley

and then you move on with whatever you're doing but so I literally would like seeing behind something to see what would happen right cuz I'm just fighting sociologist and I'm going to figure this out with testing and it didn't stop people

people anyways with blown out that I was going to come over here and kiss me so

I did eventually incorporate that I did I know what am I going to do with my life or am I going to find a way to meet these people where they're at and blended into how I do it and so but I think there was a valuable lesson there that even for somebody who's aware of these issues if he made you feel uncomfortable so I empathize with people and their potential feelings discomfort I think that's where that's where we don't have time and ground I think that's the issue and in the US that people get uncomfortable with other people's differences I don't think it's as much they don't like it it's just the discomfort did anybody say well I thought you were Mexican American

like today in fur that hey you should be comfortable aren't you Mexican you know I'm thinking while I have I'm starting to notice all these different there isn't just one way of being even for me but I did get some of that because it was like well how come you're not doing it to you know because for the equivalence of my handshake sort of fast forward and when I would go back to Chicago I didn't duntley start doing it automatically in this is absolutely true story remember our neighbors of good friend of my mom's neighbors of ours is where I grew up and I went to kiss her on the cheek and she was very taking a bath and base by the realization about these differences and just how ingrained it is for all of us

to have these differences right in tune in to react to them but yes now I can now how much more tune to these different ways and I'm sort of I take a brass on them you know how is this person doing it but you know it's handshakes it's hugs and kisses that's intimacy for me it's intimate 224 have to have that skin contact to kiss not intimate to me that she can wear it for my Japanese friend there is even a level of intimacy if you get into their physical space right there standing a little further apart and it's a warm person it's just that people have even different personal spaces so for our listeners will want to tell you if you want to call in and ask Michael Oher dr. April or myself a question you can call in at 1886 to 76008

yeah I was just thinking as we were talking about kissing and hand shaking and touches with this pandemic it's brought almost also another type of culture that there is no Willy 2 x skin to skin contact and there's some of us who maybe haven't been touched in orchids there are no skin contact in a very long time I might add perhaps hypothetically sociology humans in the world

yeah I mean so I'm thinking of clients that you've been had this week so I think people are still at the local level at the Grassroots what I call the Grassroots level I think a lot of them are still you know doing things are sort of prohibited so like the hookup culture with younger folks yeah I've had a couple younger clients this week that are on website someone is on Grindr right has to be gay so you know but therein lies the difference of the definitions right so I'm a larger cultural level right we have these Norms when I supposed to be doing certain kinds of things so in our meeting on practice on Melba bumping or I'm not even touching it all but I think maybe behind closed doors maybe people are so

I'm doing some of these things I don't think it's good in the end to have too much space between us right we know that there's certain physical biological chemical things that we get from interacting with other people closely besides just the scent of. Certain things from skin contact like you said some positive things even from orgasm and some other things right that said you don't get right so

it definitely affected people and I saw a rush of couples clients after right after the pandemic I don't know exactly what you did to yeah yeah I still see a lot of them something that's lacking in it is a part of almost anybody's definition of intimacy right level of closeness so when we have masks on you know when we're keeping distance is one thing at the store but hopefully people are finding ways to you know sort of to have their own subcultural experienced the difference from the dominant I don't know that's a good question though we are young people it's in times of you haven't been touched or kissed and it's or whatever the case may be no skin-to-skin contact you get to the point where you need it so much

come desperate but slaves to sin x irrational thoughts behaviors actions

yeah that's a good point to it maybe it pushes people into far in the other direction I mean in general with Society I think we signed an equilibrium I don't think we found it yet

I don't but usually we we do you know the history proves itself if we study the history of social interaction and just of society's usually there's you know this is not the first time that we've undergone a radical change I think of things that were even bigger like World War II for example where you know much of Europe was in chaos and and starving literally saw there lots of times chart history we've had other epidemics and pandemics I think we'll find an equilibrium I think humans just sort of speak that without even knowing it I don't know what that's going to look like because this is still ongoing especially here in Florida are numbers are still soaring covid infection I don't know what that looks like yet but I think people will find it right because I think it's just too important and people needed to watch the interaction

how can people be open to other forms of intimacy

I think making themselves I think educating themselves right knowing that there isn't just one way of doing everything I have a discussion with people often about you know that idea of Free Will and choice and things like that it's difficult to say we have much Free Will and choice if we don't know what the options are right if we think there's only one way of doing something and we do it automatically example I give because it's Asian Lee there is like an 18 or 19 year old freshman college students resistant to the idea that they might not know everything so yeah so I say when you went first one in the elevator and when you rode the elevator today at what point do you remember somebody explaining to the rules for how you ride in that elevator well of course there's no such thing as that we know how to ride an elevator how to grease somebody hi eat based on our culture and watching other people do it right most most knowledge is it

fix it right when I told how to do it we walked into an elevator and we're supposed to get like kind of look up right now

rice Factory. Where I like to see that though I want to know if you plan on doing it let me record that this was like 5 years ago so but I would wonder what it would happen if I say it now I got a different response nobody did do a group hug by the way but now I'm different from planet I would because you see me before I was using humor because nobody was talking

and now it would be something completely different because we're not

Hagen elevator you know smoke cigars and you know when we're supposed to Pretend We're looking at our phones even though there's no reception wink wink and you know but but so in the end I think it's just I think that has to do with also a closed space kind of thing right that were close to each other and I think a lot of people don't know how to do that right you know this is also a gendered to an extent intimacy right so you know when is it okay in Greater us culture for males to touch each other and I mean you know we know it's okay if it's their Christmas individuals it's okay but it seems to be based a lot around Sports and contact for so you'll see football if you watched TV and you'll see men slapping each other on the butt

you don't see it as much in a mall in a school in it right

if you're usual but it seems to be okay it's linked to violence it's linked to the camaraderie of the game you know things like that so why is it not okay another time text while in fact it is it's just not okay for that individual possibly but I think that's very interesting when you start bringing things like that I'll put people and noticing that there are times when it's okay to proceed okay. What about you know where a boy or a man to say I need a hug

that's a great I actually had a client ones that was ridiculed at school because he did ask a girl to snuggle and use the word snuggle in a sentence as a teenager so boy did he get ridiculed and I believe the fact that it's not is perceived as okay and I go back for like childhood right so if you're thinking about how a boy and a girl were comforted it was a pretty common site for me to see girls comforted by each other physically write a hug literally gathering around her and also physical thing it's just not that common with a male or female says he's hurting or he's crying or he's upset your general and I can have a group of men coming and sore hug him and surround me with his hair right just think he was saying that right in the classroom is soliciting a lot of laughs obviously because yeah

diving his tears you know it's like

oh I'm so glad I'm a woman must be so hard on you know where they cover off right because they still get hurt obviously they're human there's a gentleman in his sixties that I work with and he unites ask them when he was a child who was the person caregiver who when he was hurt weather it's physically or emotionally care of them or two of them were dressed at and he burst into tears and he said he never remembers one time anybody doing that

and so you know he has a hard time now reaching out and expressing feelings and and it's unfortunate you know because I think society would be healthier right if more people could reach out for help with more people were attuned to these differences with regard to the way we do things whether it's intimacy or whether it's reaching up there is a level of intimacy I stay in reaching out to somebody and wanting to and then getting their support right and it's not a Florida pandemic it's not a United States pandemic

it is a global pandemic and I know most of the countries are led by men which is okay but we're not taking a global up asking for help and so I was just thinking to myself I wonder if part of that is because of what you just said in the sense of you know going up that yeah men were taught not to ask for help until yeah because if we looked at it more as a global

head of each country and their own budget and whatever the case may be different than mine even though I'm obviously very open these kinds of things like I didn't even think of that exact thing that you just thought up but yes I do think that plays a role because you know my political science background pretty well-versed in international relations Theory and basically the prevailing theories are like you know where in a free-for-all you know when the world and we have to only do for ourselves and all that if yeah that's a pretty aggressive mentality and like you said you know everybody wanted to blame another each other's country is China's responsible people within the United States are blaming Florida and they're blaming their spring break I mean it just can be completely distilled right yes if we only had

more intimacy and cooperation so and that's just back to the the the intimacy the connection I think a lot of it is based on fear I'd like to hear what you two think but I think Just Three Brothers standing in the elevator when do you say let's group August and everyone is probably terrified right even looking down even further like this you know I think it scares people can open this right to be open we have to be you know somewhat confident we have to be maybe not scared to be open to another person's ways of doing things what do you all think about it you know I actually think that intimacy is more about affection but also we can look at cultural intimacy from language and communication because what about people that well we can't touch now and in all the way that we used to or or as freely you know but

how can we connect with people through communication what are some suggestions that either of you Michael what would you suggest how somebody could have cultural intimacy through communication

yeah I think I think I've done that I think we would probably all have done that and you know in the work that we do and that is by you know sort of using warmer works right there's like old words warm words are judgmental words using more welcoming words right I've noticed a little more exaggeration with body movement maybe even right you know because I you know I can't touch the person drinks and Scotch so maybe there's a little more of that maybe even you know even the talking about the discomfort I've done that as well bringing that up right we're at the fourth most perfunctory it's more automatic where we just kind of you are sort of motions and we coming to town we go to it so I think you know I think that demonstrates in the South love of openness and professions but I think that helps to other people know that we do

are trying to figure this out we don't have all the answers to how to do everything we're learning so I think letting other people know that and I did there was a few times I was like well I'm not sure what to do when I told the person that is less than be part of the process it shows them that I too am not a hundred percent sure about how to how to move forward with this and it does come out to in and you know I had a lot of people who receive therapy and I had somebody explicitly say that they really didn't think it was going to help them the same as it would be in person and so those are things we didn't need this dress before right because for a while that's that's all I did and I know some people still only doing that so I think your point I think it's a great Point actor Kelly the talking about it is the way that I can I cope with that in the tool that I use it literally just putting it out there

yeah thank you for sharing that and that's also when you talked about fear it's also like you were saying being open that fun ability you know that hey I don't have it all together so we're going to take a quick break but when we come back we're going to get take questions from the audience and talk about vulnerability and intimacy and how we can strengthen the bond of connections as we move forward to 2021 and hopefully a better 2022

will be back in a moment if you're listening you have a pulse if you have a pool you have stress if you have stress you should get a therapist therapist you go online type in therapist near me can you find a list of letters l m HCL PC and see see how can you navigate and understand all this go to doctor Kelly boucher.com dr. Kelly specializes in supporting people who suffer from stress anxiety and more you can have help today dr. Kelly boucher.com

welcome back to the bring an intimacy show where intimacy is real even talk with Michael O'Brien and dr. Kelly Boucher about cultural intimacy. The Kelly do you have any questions from the audience I do actually I have

Amber from Connecticut has a question about doesn't say which culture but says I'm dating somebody from a vastly different culture can you help me understand how to communicate

so that's to infer that you're having a difficult time communicating I'm sure

yeah I know which culture what would you recommend Michael right it is going to be different for some people it's going to be more physical for some people it's going to be you know more about emotional connection you know what made you a mix going to differ from subgroup to stop group for example there might be differences with regard to males and females with regard to what ethnic group your phone religion you know it's going to be a big one so I think I think you know asking somebody about these things is the easiest way to go awhile if people I might you know when I have couples in and it sometimes I'll have one person sort of asking me the questions about their partner why does someone so do this why does he or she do this I don't understand it and I'll gently suggest that they ask the person sitting next to me

important did ask them to me right so the communication part asking them their preferred way of communicating love you know what's your love language is I think sometimes doing these assessment even though even though they're not all like Star scientific can be helpful as well right so doing an assessment about what your love language is but definitely just the open communication about asking them and then also observing them in the context of their cultural background I think helps a lot right how do they interact with family with friends so that we can sort of you know be open to their way of doing things and observe I would say amber observe how they interact with their family and how they communicate with her family I say try to do it with her now correct this is this what I say for dating I used to say the teenagers you know try to hold off kissing as long as you can

so that you can become a little more intimate and they're like what I'm like well it's hard to communicate with somebody's tongue in your mouth right so the communication stops when the physical begins sometimes to make sure you have a healthy balance with that you have any questions doctor April from the audience I was just going to say on the end of that question is also understanding how it how to deal with conflict because I was thinking like in some cultures that there's a problem we discussed it right then and there who cares what who's around or what saying and others it's like oh my gosh I don't want do you know what we have to wait till we get home which happens a lot and communication

yes absolutely and we see him you know right well here will hear this and see this in their explanations of how their conflicts happen and then we'll hear you know I'll ask how will it be hot when you were a child who was a disciplinarian or something like that and it'll start getting pretty clear about why they have these different this cuz will hear like well you know my husband walks away doesn't want to talk about it and I want to sell the right then and there what's wrong with him or vice a versa

little sister doing a different so if there was a mutual understanding maybe things would go better and I like your point back to Cali about that right so you know going to something physical very quickly can often be avoided I think right avoidance of having to figure those things out from I'm actually from Florida anything that's different people come moving into this country they should really adopt the American culture I don't understand

why we would tolerate all these different cultures

can I answer to that one thing so there's no such thing as American culture there's sort of isn't sort of isn't right we're back to that dominant and non-dominant is no one American culture what is it going to it tell me what it is right is it eating tacos because there's taco places Now everywhere we live in a place Naples were really expensive taco places so the beginning point is a little bit you know needs to be a little bit teased out in the fact that there is no one American culture there are many many many subcultures in their eyes have been in America yes there are 10 to be one sort of dominant way of doing things I think it's healthy for both parties to meet each other where they're at and you know what we call cultural infusion

things sort of are mixed I think that's the only possible way for for society to function healthily or an individual or a couple right to dab some of each other crazy and we do this this is why we have like text next week we want to get really literally right literally the mixing of cultures it's not quite Mexican it's not quite American it's a mixed this is a common thing that's not new and it's been going on for forever

yeah say I'm an appointment I never back in the day that used to teach us about a Melting Pot and then it went into more of a salad

where do you stand on that yeah right so I think I'm melting pot is very flawed because it makes it so it makes it sound like everything you know literally melts into each other which is not the case

right it's not the case you know I'll take the fist bump for example I remember when Barack Obama was President and he occasionally fist-bump people and I remember there was a lot of people on the web didn't like that

well it's just a different way right it's it's maybe not you know I'm sure he shook hands with some people but with some people's a fist bump in my own private life with friends and people I trained in martial arts within such worthless pumping we're not shaking hands and we always did so there's no one way of doing anything and we don't melt into stuff where were these differences were vegetables chopped up writing her pieces are in whole and we're in the same Bowl but that doesn't mean we have to take on all the characteristics of the other person and I think that's a very damaging thing to no one is saying that you have to become like the people that are coming in or the other group but perhaps just being open to being okay with their way of doing it so like you don't see your views or Salad not a form of the green pepper is maybe not interfering with the lettuce and eating the two together is probably taste better if you see where my head's at I'm getting hungry but you know it it taste better when the when the when the flavors you know are sitting together

but yeah I think it's very flawed to think that everything sort of just melt into one thing cuz it it really isn't true

what I would say to also to individuals like Joe as a question or the the thought like saying you know I really think that you know how should I be expected to tolerate all these different cultures I live in America I'd be like Joe just don't date somebody from a different culture and then guess what Joe you're going to be very lonely for a very long time because we all have a different culture even within our same but I'm in northern Michigan right now so I mean it's like 2%

I was 14 years at 2% so it's kind of like what even within that there are so many different cultures so it's really not about ethnicity or race it is about culture so you know you're really going to be up a creek if you do not handle the fact that this is a personal thing and it's really you can have intimacy with individuals and and it's a lonely life if you don't figure out how it's not about tolerating it's about celebrating

India anything also I was thinking you are you there from there originally back to Cali from Michigan were so similar neck of the woods to Chicago Northern Illinois I mean yeah so we can also look at this overtime I mean that's the other thing in in teaching you know sort of to Joe's question radically overtime they differ from place to place so that's a great point right so and I was talking about that about my Chicago versus Miami but they've also differ drastically overtime What was seen as okay for people to do and what was considered intimate I saw a picture recently of people on the beach in the 18 hundreds in the women like showing their ankles being very you know out there in sexual showing their ankles right being very sassy right now

so it's not the case that this is a static thing to this culture estatica changes drastically over time and sexuality intimacy for sure has changed over time we think of Victorian as covering everything up right when people and sociologists look at closer to time Victorian times is about covering up everything long dresses multiple layers of stuff now not so much so at what point are we using that sort of this is our culture thing it differs from 50 years ago to now and it's going to be different in another twenty to fifty years your point and if we don't acclimate to these differences we get left behind a little bit

that's true I admire you for asking that question though because that's very direct communication and I respect that and it is good for us to ask these questions

thank you Michael so much for being on the show how can I connect with you and also tell us a little bit about this mindfulness that you're so I've been practicing mindfulness for a very long time 15 20 years I got to see the Dalai Lama in person and so basically you know what one of the things I like about it coming from a culture where you know do it yourself is especially for males this is something you can just sort of do on your own find a breathing exercise right breathe breathe slowly we can always control our breath we can't control all these things were talking about right we can't control what's going to happen with covid-19 in the world we can always control our breath if you want to reach out my my business line is 239-330-7883 I have an eye

hold office and Telehealth appointments offices in Naples in the French Quarter and basically the idea of mindfulness is to be aware of what we're doing and what were you thinking and I'm Letting Go so this very much applies the top were talking about because we don't have to like the way the other person does things right so I prefer and I feel more comfortable with shaking hands it's okay that I don't like in for for the other ways it just means not judging them based on the way I do it it's a very different thing so being aware

a Man simply letting go of it okay so you do it differently that's okay very non-judgmental I think it gets us out of that trap of like which way do we go with it we do it my way or do we do with your well that's a very Funeral Service sort of aggressive way of looking at it we don't have to do it that way and I was just thinking of you and I have talked and I know that you've experienced and racial Injustice and you shared something that happened in Naples and I was just thinking you know what how you dealt with that of the police

it's a lot of it's because of your practice of mindfulness for sure actually

I do have a very I developed to go to Billy I didn't always have it and that's the one thing I tell my clients people you know certain look at you now and say well you have this all figured out while I mean you know I've been through some stuff to get where I am and it's the result of years of practice in the fact that I do these things regularly but I'm able to stay in the moment and and sort of really cheap aware of what's going on for me as I'm doing things that helps in all facets it helps with stressful interactions like the one you're talking about it helps when I teach so in a variety of contexts it's useful for pretty much everything so I'm like such a huge proponent said you know what improve my life on a personal level but for sure any stressful situation where you know we're not in control because that's inevitable but the feeling is it's a loss of control so you know sort of those police lights get thrown thrown on and we see them everybody gets a little bit nervous when that happens I believe

I've asked people I guess classes and everybody gets nervous when we need to stay present we need to be aware of what we're experiencing what we're feeling in order to be able to be your best self cuz in the end that's I know what all three of us want right we want people to be their best selves and I think that helps

night I think that most people really do want to be better and have you no be kinder and have a better self and and certainly no surprise that we have Life podcast going out the roof like people are educating themselves and learning and and so thank you so much for that Michael and speaking about podcast going through the roof congratulations dr. April on bringing in the sea that show which many of you know or may not know that it's in its 11th year so the first time in over a decade of doing this and you're in the top 200 for Apple podcast on relationships here at the bringing in terms of actual congratulations on that describe two of the ring and Lucy basketball on your favorite podcast whether it's apple or whatever other player you listening to subscribe to follow us on Instagram of course Facebook and YouTube

and also you can write up write a review on iTunes if you're listening on iTunes our upcoming shows are laying your retirement foundation with Jim maginon next week Nicki Minaj unlocking your Genius that sounds so cool that's like IQ is sexy isn't it sitting with God I went from saying sexy to God and the Saints are sitting with Dad you know be still and know that he is God October 7th is Jorge and Denise this where is Affair recovery I'm so interested in that so thanks so much for listening it's been great spending time with you Michael O'Brien thank you Michael again if you are welcome back to Michael any time to spend that bring an intimate be intimacy intimacy Israel see you guys next week