welcome to the bring intimacy back show where intimacy is real on the show we believe that intimately connecting with yourself your significant other children Family Friends Business Network community and your higher power can elevate your life to work towards a positive future that's we explore intimate topic inspiring life stories spiritually and insightful tips on strengthening relationship this show is hosted by dr. April a Florida licensed mental health counselor relationship and intimacy therapist board certified telemental health counselor National Certified counselor and a certified sex therapist

she is the owner of vacation counseling and Cape Coral therapist and the creator of the internet connections newsletter for more information about dr. April services and the bring intimacy back please visit bringing intimacy back. Com check out past shows on Apple iTunes Spotify YouTube or wherever you listen to your podcast now let's get this episode of the bring intimacy back show started because we share with you the secret power to intimacy to create a like you love or love the life you create now here's your host dr. April

hi welcome to the bring intimacy back to where intimacy is real so on today's topic is something that's very special to me is talking about spirituality how I spirituality doing this time. With that covid-19 and a lot of things that are happening in the world how is that helping us and why is that important and so today I wanted to have someone who knows about spirituality but also has a passion for social justice and still do that helps of different colleagues and friends I found the perfect guy to bring to you guys I would like to welcome Reverend CJ McGregor welcome thank you for inviting me yes thank you so much for being on the show and one thing I want to let you know I'm Reverend CJ just want to give you a little background about his history he was born in New York and he ham

husband have been pregnant for 27 years and Mary back in 20 2004 where I'm at to adult children he has a degree in English is also a Adjunct professor apply Administration has done a lot of work in non-profit organizations in New York and Massachusetts I'm he's done a lot and also he's also on satellite in helping the community and also in Florida he has served as the director of religious education for 8 years in Massachusetts is also serves as a Hospice chaplain on a chaplain and forensics in Massachusetts and his house of Court serves as a head Pastor here in Florida he described himself as a theater was a strong humanistic learning that means that he feels and held by something greater and he believes we can save ourselves if we are committed to Love & Justice he holds his freedom of belief very hard and it

what is that we all imagined all of us have a place at the table and he encourages the Unitarian Universalist 6 to walk the walk and talk the talk he describes his ministry s Pastoria stating that he receives the greatest satisfaction being in relationship with his members also caring and support and deciding welcome yeah one of the things that of course in this area of covid-19 many of us are doing a lot of different things and stuff and I'm just curious as a reference that is holding up a church and I'm looking at yourself a lot of nonprofit work you to how are you doing everybody together well of course I'll say I'm doing well and I think I am I'm feeling like a lot of people are feeling you know

anxieties about what will calm anxiety but one of my anxieties is I think I hope that I'm supporting the people my congregation the best way I can and they have what what they need so doing offering pastoral care is there a big distraction for me being able to focus on their needs and I I told you earlier that

I just took a vacation to New York to the Adirondack Mountains in so that some self-care that I've been doing but I'm Feeling Again feeling like a lot of people anxious especially as we enter our 7th months of isolation taking time for yourself cuz that's critical it is one of the ways we can sustain ourselves during this pandemic is thinking of ways to care for ourselves it's important of people and being irreverent

sure well many years ago my oldest son is 30 now and when he was 7 we we adopted him and he looked at us and said when are we going to church we had been on we had been on church that that time having been raised Catholic I decided to leave that church because I thought it was exclusive not inclusive and he might my son had been with a family that they went to church at least 5 days a week and so then we adopted him he's asked us like I said when we were going to church and so we found a church that shared our value and that was the Unitarian Universalist Church

and So eventually I became the director of religious education for a Unitarian Universalist Congregation in Massachusetts and we had we had just welcomed the new Minister and she was so Dynamic that I felt I got I felt that I wanted to go deeper and become more intimate in my relationships with people and in a spiritual way so

and also I have been thinking about Ministry before then but thought you know I think before we all go to Seminary we think we'll maybe this isn't for me you know I couldn't be a minister I have to have to do this this semester but it's a nagging that I felt it was a pushing me to do it then when I answered Seminary that nagging went away so yeah that's how I describe my call inspired by another Minister and listening to the small boys that was nagging me

yes yes and so I mean mention the Unitarian Universalist it I many people may be saying that will what is that I've never heard of that sure yeah I kind of Unitarian universalism comes from the 14 + 1500 + Transylvania which is now present-day Romania and then it moved West eventually going to Europe and then I sue the United States basically we are founded on inclusion

that Unitarian won't let start with trinitarian trinitarian meeting 3 the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit but Unitarian is one God God and the idea that Jesus is a prophet and someone who's Ministry we should imitate but not divine

so that's one God so Yuna and universalism universalists believed that in one God and that everyone they believe in Universal salvation that everyone will be saved and so when you come to our congregation rather than be handed something that says this is what we believe and you must believe it to be a welcome here we welcome you and ask what you believe and we help you go deeper in that so you know in our congregation we have Muslims we have Christians we have Buddhist we have non-believers we have

humanist everyone comes together and we identify ourselves as Unitarian Universalist first and then what we believe personally find it so all of that all of our beliefs are encouraged and accepted what the kind brings to us right now

right right so we assume it's very inclusive

yes so I'm on today's topic about you answers I know that and you can you just mention that about Intimacy in the sense of being connected with people so I would like to know what is your definition of spiritual intimacy

not unlike other types of intimacy

spiritual intimacy for me is about being able to connect with those we love and care for about spiritual matters and have the confidence that we won't be rejected when we become intimate and share its I guess it's feeling safe being completely open and honest about our faith with someone else and sharing thoughts and questions and what are spiritual needs are and what our spiritual struggles are and that's something unique about the Unitarian Universalist Congregation or all face is that that's exactly what we do we become spiritually intimate by asking people to share their thoughts and questions and struggles of making it safe to do so so I think that's what that's my definition of spiritual intimacy

right right which is so powerful and in today's world right now well isolated because it is that in the sense of being able to share your face with your isolated

are you supposed to be a boy but I think we all have a human needs to be part of something or to be connected to other people and so

during this pandemic that's been a little tricky being able to have those intimate relationship being able to connect with people so at our congregation for example we've used assume a lot We Gather groups of people together and talk we have were able to offer education and learning over resume the most of all around people of space to join in conversation and having those intimate conversations about spirituality and otherwise

I know you talked about how you receive such a great satisfaction

and in that yeah can you explain that I think the most satisfying part of Ministry for me is having those intimate relationships with people going deeper than sort of a casual relationship or friendship that you might have but really listening to their stories and intimate struggles and concerns and celebration so when I teach students in seminary

ministerial formation I tell them there are three parts of ministry you have the preacher the teacher and the pastor and so I like them to think about those three parts and decide what order they will put them in for example someone gets a one of my insurance Minister lanterns had a real passion for a teaching an adult education so she would put teaching preaching Pastor for me because I get the most satisfaction of those Intimate Relationships for me it would be Pastor teacher preacher that makes sense that when you're forming yourself as a minister you have to think about those three areas and put them in the order that

that you can identify with

that definitely makes sense I'm because as humans were born connected as a pastor helping people to connect and talk about spirituality and in that connection even with their higher power you know it is so circular I mean I believe that the most important role of a minister is to help people spiritually mature that's why I'm there and through preaching teaching and your pastoral care and especially how we can do that during this time. And this in 2020

during this difficult time that we are all facing

many people are in need of someone to talk to when option is speaking to a therapist to express your anxieties if you're feeling isolated or just need someone that will listen to help you with coping skills to get through

dr. Amy Brown is now accepting new clients and is working with her existing clients through distance video counseling the services are through a secure online HIPAA based practice management platform called Simple practice this technology can provide a secure two-way interactive video counseling session over the internet

for more information about video counseling please email dr. April Brown at info at dr. April Brown

calm or you may call 239-565-6921 thank you and remember we are all in this together

okay welcome back to the bring an intimacy show where intimacy is real on this topic today we are talking about spirituality and spiritual intimacy during the covid-19 and I guess today is Reverend CJ McGregor yes and so I'm in our last segment we were talking about I'm spiritual maturity yes I'm so now I'm made of this topic many of us are many of us that I hear are in this covid-19 and a lot of different other things that are happening in the world today we're feeling torn in isolated so what does spiritual maturity is spiritually grounding have on us and how can we start working on that right so

I call it spiritual practice what can help us during these times Weatherby we're talking about pandemics or racial Injustice or you know

our environments we have whatever concerns are we can manage with a spiritual practice I believe and so I read somewhere recently that when we're in the dark and we feel so isolated and alone or whatever we're managing we just need to look for the light switch so for me that's what a spiritual practices is that like switched it's something that can ground us something that can we can hold onto during this time

call Bo and I'll explain example my spiritual practice you know some of the work I do is heart-wrenching anxiety-provoking and I always need to understand that the pain that I'm witnessing from others is not my pain 6 share but it's mine it's paying that I need to respond to does that make sense and so a spiritual what allows me to do that work and maintain my sustain myself. I often start and end the day with reading scripture or poetry

or something that holds me that I am Browns me and so

when I'm in times of struggle I can hold on to those things and return to those things too

to begin again have the the health and mental health than the physical and spiritual help to read to go back out there and do it another day so anything that I would describe spiritual practices anything that holds us sometimes people will call a spiritual practice by going kayaking or walking through the woods like I said reading scripture something that we do on a routine basis that we know will sustain us and that we can return to when we are having two

many of us ever having difficult times in these difficult times and even believe because if there was a higher power or Spiritual Beings you know our world would be rude all be getting along with the virus yeah. I would say that we're placing the blame in the wrong on the wrong thing or person for example if we're coming from a christ-centered face God

I wouldn't hold a Jesus or God responsible for what's happening around us I think for me and my theology I think we're giving everything we need and can ask for strength through prayer or whatever your spiritual practice maybe these things are happening not because of

God's or Cheese's in Des Moines

we believe in unitarian-universalism those who are Christian and Universal us especially that God is a loving God God wouldn't put his people in this position and so what we're seeing is created by ourselves

a virus a wildfire a hurricane that's hitting the southern coast as we speak these are not acts of God as their faults may be in your Stern God is a loving God and I think we we need to I also you remember I said what I think we can save ourselves and a lot of the tensions that were singing our lives today like the racial tensions mass shootings are you know all of these things that bring us grief and worry we are responsible for those things we can save ourselves by committing to morality by committing to compassion by committing to Justice and Equity weekend we've created this we can solve this

so it's when people say why would God RR whoever we believe and do this to me you're placing the blame on the wrong person yeah that makes sense and when you're talking about we're talking about the whole whole wide world that's correct because of that there's been you know but it's evil or selfishness or whatever the case maybe that is car some of these these things we were given everything we need to create the world we dream about we just need to do it when everything that we need and I know that there have been many of us are some of us who have lost loved ones either open or maybe they've lost loved ones through traumatic experience

do police shooting of maybe the mass shootings are as she said now that we're in Hurricane Season how do you help someone who is going to greet you know what I'm saying who's don't feel like they can't even make it

inside of us

yeah I think we we do people find themselves sometimes where they believe they they can't go on and so I think it's our responsibility for empathy and compassion

and to listen and simply be there showing up is the major part of this I even during this time of isolation there are ways we can show up even if we can do it physically we can we can check in on people off that weekend urge others to check in on them weekends

process this window and sort of be someone they lean on them so they don't need anyone Selena on to get through this

I think intimacy and connection even Weatherby over the phone and through cards and letters or Zoom even

is is hope for people it's only when we find ourselves in that position and we would look around and no one is there to console us or offer us a hand or some hope we'll go deeper in our belief that we can't do this when you sent that it's you know how many people are experiencing grief they feel they have a hole or something and you're talking about we can do it next time. Device

help yeah something interesting that's happening right now right now during this pandemic is that I have a few people in my congregation or family members that have died during this pandemic and they aren't able to visit them before they die after they die or in some instances of even attend their burial or funeral service so that's a whole nother level of what does pandemic brings and again I think spiritual on personal intimacy is a good remedy surface-level of your your fake your belief or when you're going deep or that I like I enjoy

or maybe even I need to have those deeper relationships with people and I think I know when I'm going deep is when I see people in their worst moments when they have reached the bottom

and they're reaching out to me to help build them back up on that so level of relationship that you don't get typically day today when people share their their grief and there and their celebrations with me

that's a

that's another way of going deeper things that they might not share with other people and so when I said that I wanted to join the ministry and crave those deeper relationship I want to go from the day-to-day relationship and go deeper with people in those ways and be part of them becoming emotionally and spiritually healthy again for Mr again does that answer your question

Vegeta's means is I get to point it out emotional connection I'm sorry I think you know you're busy for a relationship happening when people are still confident that you won't judge them and that it's safe to share their cheapest feelings that they don't share with anyone else or on a day-to-day basis and so we talked about spiritual intimacy that's exactly how spiritual intimacy works that something that's difficult especially during these times is telling people what you believe or who you believe in and so we don't feel confident or space when we do that so spiritual intimacy is connecting with another human being

are a community such as all face

you won't receive judgment for that bill that it's safe to have those questions and feel unsure and different beliefs that's intimacy Bob not unlike other and some other other ideas of inch of intimacy when hanging out with someone who you're married to or other people you are for the intimate part becomes intimate when you feel safe and confident that you can do that right to be that person for people you mentioned the word safe because you're right so many of us don't feel safe in expressing even maybe I loved ones about our face of belief system just that where we feel we can share our intimate

beliefs about politics and religion and it doesn't work out for us yeah yeah it so people are feeling isolated and stuff so it's resource. They're such as yourself and the church that you provide with that can help people

yeah like I said we ask people what they believe and we helped him go deeper we don't hand them what they should believe in the whole sense of even being

we've been talking about spirituality spiritual and being religious is there

yeah there is I think a growing number of Americans especially younger Americans are identifying as spiritual and not religious and so people who wants space but don't want to identify with a particular religion

mites call themselves spiritual so they don't want to they don't want to connect themselves to a particular dog so

people who disagree with churches or congregations on political issues issues they feel restricted by the dogma of religion

they're those of the people they're moving toward spirituality being religious means identifying with an organized religion and believing the dog was that they hand you being spiritual the same as identifying with

a larger and for your Arena to explore big questions and having that safety and encouragement to explore the big big questions for being religious means you're comfortable with what you believe being decided for you I believe and being spiritual allows you connect to communities that share your values and you're able to explore which is all face by the way they had am still within the session and someone was just trying to figure out what they believe so when you're trying to figure that out if not helpful to be handed a script and saying this is what you believe

but I got as a Unitarian Universalist we believe that let's put all options on the table let's figure this out let's build our own Theology and so that's what we teach our kids as well as that we offer them everything every religion we talked about all say we expect we encourage them I should say expect encourage them as adults to choose what they believe and follow that

yeah yeah yeah

when people are able to choose their more able to be authentic and where you talked about earlier was showing up yeah and how important that is a lot of times people believe are what we were given at Birth the religion of our family and so we were we can to continue to identify with that and not necessary believing it but identifying with it because it's what we do in our family yeah

yeah and so going on in this town topic now about showing up yes yes what is that actually means showing up

well in the context of pastoral care are offering people support and help showing up means simply means being there and listening listening is the big cheezy we're not we're not rushing in with what we believe or what people should we think people should do we're just there for as a support and we're listening I think other ways of showing up as what you mentioned is authenticity

showing up with our true selves having the confidence that we can show our our true selves our real selves is another way of showing up isn't it a waste of time to form relationships with someone

relationships that are authentic that are built on

niceties and things that sings we do that Pete we think people want us to do and say so it has a lot going up as a lot to do with authenticity and that's part of spiritual maturity because he is being authentic knowing who you are what you believe

and being able to expose that to others

yeah and I was thinking in the sense of spirituality showing up like you said it's been Crescent and listening and I also see it's listening to our inner voice in our Spirits before we have two voices in her voice has one is the voice that tells us what we are not that they're bad or resist aware that that's not our boy that's someone else's voice but if we listen to our voice that other still Small Voice that guides us and leads us in the way that we know that what's the word

intuition that's the voice we should be listening to because that is our true voice the other voice isn't our voice the voices of others

right and it comes in my session sometimes when I ask people how did they hear God what is what is God of the higher power thing today sometimes they can't distinguish between the voices of others you know you know I'm no one's good for me or whatever they're

where's his hearing that voice inside of them

I just I do just that I tell them to listen because what what what you're letting happen is the voice is about divorce that isn't yours that's coming from outside all those people who have said those things you're letting it drown out that other voice so you just need to listen and try to get through those voices to the other smaller voice

does that make sense. That makes sense that makes sense that I'm just so clouded by stuff from that other people said that to me have a hard time hearing our intuition another thing that I think it's helpful that I tell people is I just tell them that you're enough keep telling yourself that you are enough and what you bring to the table is enough what you bring to our congregation is enough what you bring to your loved ones is enough and if you cheat that's a spiritual practice to keep telling yourself that and to live in that way that you are enough you'll eventually living to it because I'm thinking many times people are have a lot of fear

absolutely

yeah living in fear of the anxiety that that provokes is debilitating and I'm saying it would some people in the community my family and our congregation that they're becoming paralyzed because of the fear and I usually ask them again this is the spiritual part test like you mentioning she has to practice I really do believe we will get through this if we have those practices a spiritual practice that I had credit

is it is that they're teaching on suffering and so Buddhist sheets that if we have an outcome already plans and mines or housing should be

when that doesn't happen we're going to suffer but if we're mindful of today night sometimes I even tell people you need what we need to tell ourselves is that right now and this hour or this day this week I'm okay I'm okay I'm safe and so if you need to do that by the hour or by the day do it because I think I think that's helpful so if a lot of what's happening I think people have an idea that this shouldn't be happening why is this pandemic happening why am I not able to do this why can't I do that we need to practice acceptance another practice radical acceptance I call it and so radical acceptance means that you understand the that

we don't have control of most of this and so like the Buddha speech if we think we do and live without understanding we're going to have suffering but if we accept what's happening except our limitations at the moment and accept that this is temporary lb less suffering

yeah definitely in other words week if we don't resist you just accept it really rattles us and it can really do Billet 8 us seeking that control it's just not going to happen in the whole idea of sort of internalizing that this is temporary because it is

I think Reverend CJ for you to tell a little bit about what you do with your church has to offer anyone have any questions to call a we have a call in number is 188-627-6008 so yes tell us about yourself joining us on the Reverend CJ McGregor I'm the minister of all faiths Unitarian congregation in Fort Myers and what I would want you to know is that at all face you will find a diverse and spiritual community that welcomes people with many beliefs and you can bring your whole self your real identity your full identity you're questioning mind than your expansive heart because all face we have more than one way of experiencing the sacred

when you enter our door we will ask you what you believe and help you go deeper in that rather than tell you what you should believe and no matter who you are wherever you are on your spiritual journey and no matter whom you love you are always welcome at all face at All Saints we offer services every Sunday right now they are on a line on our Facebook page and facebook.com all states you see you can join our virtual Services every Sunday we also have a number of programs that were offering through resume we have

Zoom conversations that you can join and get acquainted with other members of the congregation learn more about all faiths I'm always available by calling our office at 239-226-0900 to help you understand All Saints we are about Justice equity and compassion those are the areas that are Ministries I'll work with them we are presently working with people who are homeless and all things we are leader in response to climate change in our community we are feeding the hungry and we are supporting people in our congregation and in the community and many ways we also are very jeddak

racial Justice and if you want to become part of our Ministries and changing and building the world's and the community that we dream about all faiths is the perfect place to start so please go to all states you you. Org and check out our website and you'll see a YouTube channel there where you can check out our path services and if you'd like more information please contact our congregation again at 239-226-0900 speak to Regina kilmartin and she'll be able to connect you in many ways to our newsletter to our meetings online and Sewer Services I hope to see you there

thank you so much for telling us about your services and stuff like that and and now it would like me to I know you talked a little bit about some of the practices of reading scripture and and being present are there any other practices that are people out there that are listening and they're like you know I'm I'm really struggling and I really feel like I I need to get connected and I don't know we're sorry

yeah the thing about spiritual practices that you can have a personal spiritual practice or you can have a spiritual practice that you're sharing with others no matter what identify one that holds you I think a lot of people see the spiritual practices of others than they think so maybe I should be doing that but that's not how it works we need to think about and understand what holds off personal one and make a practice of that and so other ways that I think the reading of scripture or poetry even sitting making time for yourself alone

you know even though we are isolated and we're not doing as much as we used to I find we're still all pretty engaged in the car Dale and are in routines and sharing for other people a spiritual practice can be just sitting alone for a period of time everyday meditation I use guided meditation because if I try to meditate iPod but guided meditation offers you something to focus on in the air moves through it so I think what we one thing we've learned during this pandemic is that technology can be our friends and amazing use technology such as Zoom or Facebook create intentional group so creating groups with people that you share things with to talk about spirituality or two

from their experiences that they're sharing so either intentionally create those groups or become part of those intentional group and then I am saying intentional because it's part of

it's acting it's not just thinking about it if we are intentional about joining a group or creating a group ever become a practice

and I think what you know I mentioned spending time alone and self-care I think we all need that the other thing I need to practice is self-compassion so having compassion for ourselves a video conversation with our congregation about a month ago and we decided and accepted that it is okay not to be okay during this time we're all responding in ways that would be expected of US during this time so have some self compassion and don't feel like I shouldn't be feeling this way or I shouldn't be doing this or I should be doing this instead and look how good they are doing and I'm not stop compassion goes a long way the other thing we talked about already is acceptance accept you how your I mean

open house ending suits these difficult times accepting its limitations and accepting again I think I keep saying is that it's temporary but we will get to the other side of this someday when it's it's terribly difficult but we have to remember to wear more in the dark turn on the switch look for the switch and turn it on Dale's there's like there is light and that's a practice is looking for the switch and turning it on. It's critical that even all the greatest Prophet Jesus of time by himself just two

human bodies we have to recharge and former co-workers you're listening or people who helping take care of people many times we take care of everybody but we need to get to take care of ourselves also mention that self-compassion.

Yes many many of our spiritual folk now and then history over centuries have you know we might have gone to a case that's reason to be alone and we need that time especially if we'll be going to become spiritually spiritually mature and spiritually intimate we need that to replenish ourselves to to sync really honestly think about what's going on around us and how we might respond

when I first plan my trip to the Adirondacks last over the last month I realized that I would have to be quarantined in New York once I got there New York

requires a two week 14 days quarantine and at first I thought I would cancel my trip. I didn't want to do that but then I thought I'll be quarantined I'll be alone I'll be able to do what I wanted to do reflect sing read them all of those things that can be tools for us to cope and it was like yes. You have a reverence TJ this has been so amazing you've been a blessing to have in the show yeah I'm going to make sure I have the phone number of you out there listening you want to connect with all face the phone number is 239-226-0900 if you want to look them up online they have a website and on WW all faced with an S you use. Org and they have a Facebook I'll take

what did I ask you see I'm saying you are Savage Twitter account yes and thank you so much for being in the show yes yes is there anyone who's out there listening and you want to get to know more information about what I think and check me out of my website at dr. April brown.com or Cape Coral therapist and if you'd like to show check out the website talk w w bring intimacy back thank you so much for being on the show and listening and we will see you guys the next time