Speaker Identification

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock, host. Identified by the opening introduction and his role presenting articles, sponsor reads, and video summaries.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates, guest and law-enforcement analyst. Identified by the host's introduction and by his extended responses concerning constitutional standards, DOJ investigations, training, and tactics.

Speaker 3 - Prerecorded Galls Sponsor Voice. Identified by the distinct first-person Galls advertisement.

Speaker 4 - Body-Camera / Dispatch Audio. Used for commands, emergency-radio traffic, and recorded incident audio embedded in the program.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
Welcome to Leo Roundtable at LEORoundtable. com. My name is Chip DeBlock and I'm your host and we're a group of law enforcement professionals. to talk about today's news and issues, but we do it from a law enforcement perspective. And I'm going to introduce Dr. Travis Yates. He's retired major from the Tulsa Police Department and he also is the founder of law officer. dot com. And yeah, we're not even close to being done. He is the author of the courageous police leader travels the country doing seminars as. well because we do have a problem with courageous police leaders. Look no further than Minneapolis. It's just crazy. And speaking of that's going to be one of our main stories coming up. But thank you so much for being on the show. Dr. Travis Yates, appreciate it. I shout out to our sponsors. You know, we have our title sponsor, Galls at Galls. com. And don't forget, they've given us that discount code, which I'm getting ready to give to you. It's easy to remember, but don't forget it because you've always got 15% off with goals. with it. It's Radio 15. So remember, Radio 15. Next time you go to the Galls. com, we have CompliantTechnologies. com or satellite sponsor,. GunLearn. com, MyMedicare. live and Tobellas. com. They're both a new online store at LEORoundtable. com. I shout out to Brian Burns for the free press at TampaFP. com. Ray Dietrich from Alummond. com and Travis Yates with Law Officer dot com.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
Thanks for helping make the show happen. And now what in world are we talking about today? I've already hinted. We've got a bunch of news sources. Listen to the these are just the titles guys at least six Minnesota federal prosecutors resign. amid pressure to treat Renee Good, you know, our bad girl Karen killing as an assault on. a nICE agent. We've also got Minneapolis police shooting claims that the officer morale is at an all. time low Tom Homann and confirmed that the ICE agent who shot Renee Good is actually been. forced in the hiding. We heard that yesterday and finally the DOJ. Dr. Travis Yates is a favorite organization. Their civil rights division. Not even getting better. Excluded of the Minneapolis shooting investigation, but we're going to get some inside scoop on. that. And I think it's all going to fall in the shoulders of our doctor or very own Dr. Travis Yates. So I can't wait to cover that. We've also got, you know, I'm going to hold the seal story until tomorrow because that's. we're going to have our special forces guy on tomorrow, but we do have a suspect to shop. by Baltimore police officers when he drives the vehicle. Let them as we got yet another shooting of somebody weaponized in the vehicle. We've got police shoot a knife building suspect in St. Louis airport. We got a surveillance video showing an apparent incendiary weapon being fired at a Greenville.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
police officer during an ambush. That's pretty wild. Idaho Falls police fatally shoot a domestic disturbance suspect when he grabs a large. knife and Christopher Taylor. He's reinstated as a police officer, including this license. You're going to get more scoop on that. We have Tom the cover it. And then finally body-camera video shows a man throwing a Washington State trooper to the ground. It was a female, a female lieutenant stealing and stealing her patrol her cruiser. Wow. That was that's just so embarrassing. Anyhow, if you're ready, Dr. Yates will get started with it with the deep stuff. here. It's news. com the Liberty Daily dot com. And finally, we have two articles from LawOfficer. com. So I'm going to read these and I'm going to go through them. But I try to stack them so that we can finish up a law officer and have Dr. Yates kind of. you spread the wealth on this thing at least six Minnesota federal prosecutors resign amid. pressure to the treat Renee Good killing as an assault on a nICE agent. Now if you guys have seen the video, I'm still getting I posted something on LinkedIn. I know Travis is posted. He's seen he's been on LinkedIn and seen it. There were so many uneducated, uninformed people. It is really scary. Now, I will say that I got in the conversation about this shooting because there's clear. video evidence, clear video evidence showing that not only does she hit the cop, you know,.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
the ICE agent, but she drug him backwards. Irrefutable fact factual, just not even being a testing or if you can find it, I went on. and tried to find it because I had a guy denying it. Then he said, Oh, show me the whole clip. He's just not happy with it. He wants to see the whole video, but I went to find it. Travis, I couldn't find it anywhere. And I went back and I saved the link and I finally got it that way. It took me quite a while, but it's not readily available for people, which is my first flag. Travis Yates. You can't find that video showing the hit. You can only find the obstructive one where you it looks like maybe you stand to the side. of the vehicle. Surprise.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
Yeah, it's almost like what Sheriff David Clark famously said that the cops are so bad. People can't stop lying about it. Yeah, I just it just Gary. So I do want to offer look, and we want to be fair. There's a lot of ignorant people out there or people who they don't care what the truth. is. They just don't want any part of it. They're not going to acknowledge it like there's one guy on there that said even. when von Klim offered look, I'll send you the video. And he said, look, I don't even care the video you just sent me. I don't even care. We're never going to agree. He didn't care. You know, he's entering into debate and he's made up his mind and nothing you're going. to say is going to change it. Those people, those people, they're dangerous, but they just can't be safe. They just can't be safe. So going back to this article, you know, we've got at least six career prosecutors in the. Minneapolis US Attorney's office, including US Attorney Joe Thompson. They've actually resigned the office and they continue to face pressure to treat the investigation. of the fatal shooting of a Minneapolis woman by an ICE officer as an assault on the federal. officer. They had issue with that. So wait, now when I read through this, it's going to sound dire. It's going to sound like, oh my crap. Oh crap. What's going on with Trump's DOJ, right? Travis Yates is going to make sense to this. So guys, please have as I go through and I'm going to go through it because we're fair.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
We're going to give you all the information, but we're going to help you filter out the. bad stuff and understand him. And I say, wait, it's really Dr. Yates because I got a little nervous reading this. Travis. I got to be honest with you. So Thompson, who's the first guy that we're recording that quit, he also previously served. as the acting US Attorney for Minnesota. So that's another, that's another flag because he was working in Minnesota. He was appointed by President Trump. Good thing in June, served in the position until October, resigned from the attorney's. office along with Harry Jacobs, Melinda Williams, Thomas Kayhoun, Lopez, Ruth Snyder, and Tom. Hole in Hearst. So all these people left because they're not happy with investigating the crime against. the ICE officer right now. Two sources familiar with the matter. They tell CBS News, liberal source. The resignation stem from the concern over request to probe goods with surviving spouse. to be one of color that who was with her when they encountered the ICE agents or let's. just say when they stalk the ICE agents, as well as the way that the case is being treated. as an assault on a federal officer as opposed to a civil rights case. And so it also goes on to say the New York Times reported Tuesday that a number of people. familiar with Thompson's decision to leave that he also objected to the federal investigators. refusing to cooperate with Minnesota state agencies in investigating goods killing.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
So he wanted them to share all their information with the Minnesota investigators who were. refusing to help and arguably what causes issue in the first place because they were. not allowing local cops to take care of this little issue and the feds had to do it. Doug Kelly, former assistant US Attorney for Minnesota says the move is a major blow to. the credibility of the office moving forward. That doesn't sound good for Trump. Since the massive fraud scandal, Mr. Trump has lashed out against Minnesota's large Somali. American community as many of the feeding our future defendants are of Somali descent. So wow, that sounds horrible, right? So I saw the writing on the wall that one.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
Now, we're going to briefly leave that article. Don't forget what I just said because we're going to tie it in the fourth article. The number two, Tom Homan confirms ICE agent who shot Renee Good has been forced in the. high-end people out for him. Then three, Minnesota police union claims that the MPD officer morale is at an all-time. low. Gee, I wonder why. Minneapolis police morale is at an all-time low and the dangerously low staffing levels. Officers are being placed in volatile conditions according to an email sent by the union. To its police officer membership, the email from the police officer's Federation of. Minneapolis, that's the same place that our very own panelist Bob Crowell was lieutenant. and in charge of. He, they obtained crime watch obtained the email. It was addressed several issues contributing to officer stress and burnout, including. the officers having to navigate quote, shifting political narratives and political rhetoric. and inflammatory statements from elected officials. So they're they're not committed. Right. Police, thanks to Jacob Freight, Tim Waltz and even Ohara their chief. Now, Trump down to the best part about this. It's kind of all in the fourth article by LawOfficer. com, DOJ civil rights division. It's not the DOJ. And we're not just talking about many app or Minnesota. We're talking about the civil rights division. Travis will touch on what exactly they do in a minute.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
But it's based out of Minneapolis and is concerning the shooting. officials investigating the fatal January 7 shooting of Renee Good in Minneapolis have. sidelined the Justice Department unit that typically handles civil rights. reviews of officer-involved shootings according to multiple reports. The shooting. involved the federal immigration officer. The inquiry is now being led by the FBI. alongside the local U. S. Attorney's Office as reported by the Washington Post. Now we're. getting close to commercial break so we may have to finish this about for the. break but in many high-profile uses of deadly force of DOJ civil rights division. particularly as criminal section they assessed whether civil rights. prosecution is actually warranted including potential violations under a. certain federal code. It goes on the say but in this case CBS News reported that. career prosecutors who offered to deploy that they were told that a vision was. not actually going to participate. We're almost done guys. Commercial break stick. with us it'll be worth it we'll be like that. My family only cares about one. thing that I come home safe. At Galls every order begins with a promise made. with purpose. Stitched for support. Back with pride. Answered by dedicated hands. Delivering the standard. You have sworn to help. We serve more than the. mission. We serve the person. Each piece is engineered to help get our first.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
responders through the shift. Back on the same. We're going to hop over. Compliant Technologies and CompliantTechnologies. com and of course you know. our favorite product they have is called the glove but they are committed to. providing non-lethal solutions to help officers gain the upper hand safely and. rapidly in a humane low-up expander utilizing what they call their CD3. which stands for conductive distraction and de-escalation technology. Now. they're flagship product we all know by now it's called the glove. It's helped. officers tens of thousands of times with no injuries and you heard that correctly. it's it's it's called the glove and it's had no injuries. They've actually. achieved non-lethal standards in the arena that predominantly can only offer. less-lethal results and when it comes to weapons retention transition to a. sidearm or conductive energy weapon the glove of compliant technologies. com they. have virtually eliminated weapons confusion so stay ahead of the game. but Compliant Technologies and the revolutionary CD3 the hundreds of. agencies have already turned to nationwide and friends take it for me from. me when it comes to safety this is one of the most common sense hands-on. solutions has ever come along go to CompliantTechnologies. com today and tell. them that chips at you again Compliant Technologies and tell them that chips. at you'd be glad you did. Welcome back. Leo Roundtable that LEORoundtable. com.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
my name is Chip DeBlock and I'm your host for Duck we're joined by Dr. Travis. Shage for Tyler Tulsa Police Department major and we're talking about what's going down in. Minneapolis in this last article that I started on from LawOfficer. com. DOJ Civil Rights Division excluded of Minneapolis shooting investigation and I. was just talking about their you know the shooting was of Renee Good in. Minneapolis and you know Dr. Travis Yates completed an exhaustive study on the. agencies investigation of law enforcement agencies and in one case found that the. division lied or misled and 97% of the cases discussed and again let me remind. you I'm talking about the DOJ so when they're talking about the DOJ being iced. out Dr. Travis Yates is gonna break this all down to us because I we were. talking off camera and I was telling Dr. Yates that I was reading all these. flags about you know we've got U. S. attorneys or assistant U. S. attorneys you. know leaving the office and that this is not in practice and we've got a civil. rights division that usually steps in and does an investigation in there yeah. they're based out of Minneapolis but then again the guy used to be like with. the AG for Minnesota and but then I forgot about the whole DHA so it sounds. just dire like the Trump admin the DOJ is just bad things are happening and. then I read that last article from Dr. Travis Yates and ding everything.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock:
just matched up perfectly it was perfect so Dr. Yates break it down for the.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
dummies well the mainstream media writes these articles for dummies for people. that don't know anything and people will hear DOJ and they think that there's. some sort of elite investigative body and it's anything but that and first off. let's just talk facts any type of incident anywhere in the country with. law enforcement you don't immediately implement a civil rights investigation. you got to investigate the incident you got to investigate it criminally then. you have to investigate it administratively and usually down the line if. there's going to be a civil rights inquiry they will compile those. investigations and go from there so the fact that less than a week out people. are like oh my gosh they're not investigating from a civil rights it's. just ludicrous right it isn't even come in that order so obviously the article. is written to inflame people and to make people think that there's some sort of. corruption going on well the actual corruption is going on within the civil. rights division DOJ because let me people need to understand the history of. them they've been investigating law enforcement incidents for 30 plus years. and they and typically the trend is and I'm not making this up they go in after. high-profile incidents and they'll find civil rights violations no matter what. they went to Ferguson oh they didn't really find it there but they went in. the New Orleans they went to Minneapolis they go into all these cities and it's.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
triggered by high-profile bit not activity from the agency and you have to. remember civil rights pattern and practice has to be a pattern and practice. now certainly federal government can investigate for crimes and individual. incidents but people that may be upset the civil rights division is excluded so. to speak well they ought to be they don't have any right to investigate any law. enforcement agency based on the past and let me remind everybody law. enforcement you've there was something weird with this group because they would. they would find these wrong findings on these agencies and then it was just you. know with no specifics well Phoenix I know I've talked about it before but when. they investigated Phoenix they investigated him for over three years they. tried to press for Phoenix you need to just agree with us and enter into. consent decree because we found you commit obviously well thankfully the. leaders in Phoenix says well can you show us the evidence and of course the. DOJ said of course not we don't do that because you would never want to show. evidence to you know a city body that just paid millions and millions of dollars. for you to investigate them and so that sort of raised the red flag in Phoenix. they said well you know what we're just going to hold off and at the same time. we're gonna release every body-cameraera video you said was a civil rights. allegation that's what they did it's on a public website everybody can go see.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
it now the media didn't pay any attention to this but I don't know happen to have. a few months off in the summer and so I went through everybody-cameraera footage. myself on a small team of people and we basically evaluated what the DOJ said. based on the footage and that's why we found that 97% of the time they. misled our lives some were just overt lies for instance they shocked. this guy and violated civil rights committed to crime well they felt. the mission that guy was trying to stab a police officer kind of a big. old mission right and then the misled typically what they showed and you can. read the report I'll just give people the website don't go read it now it's. all up for people to see by the way and when you do research you almost welcome. people chipped you sort of critique it that's what researchers want no one's. done that they just ignored it right no media people picked it up but you. nobody wants to talk about it they want you to forget what the DOJ has done. that they lied 97% of the time and by the way that's just Phoenix in our. report we have other allegations that did to other cities based on what those. cities said and based what federal judges said they just threw out the New Orleans. one actually no the Louisville one just got thrown out because one reason the. federal judge said this isn't even true you can't even defend what you said and. so the history of the DOJ civil rights division they have to almost be.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
completely gutted now they've gutted a lot of them but you're never gonna get. rid of all of them because people don't raise their hand and say we're liars. typically right so I'm pretty disappointed in that because they're. still around obviously few more were outed here but typically what they're. what they lied about and misled about was this they have no understanding of. constitutional law which is very strange and it sounds crazy that the. investigative body on constitutional civil rights doesn't have an. understanding of the Constitution but it's just clearly they don't because they. were taking legal justified shootings in the city of Phoenix and claiming they. were civil rights violations they weren't cited in Tennessee v. Garner or grand v. connor and all the constitutional case laws and by the way I'm not some high. level expert like a jamey boardner of on-kind but I bet I know what the. Constitution says and these cases are not hard to decipher and these. lawyers and I believe these lawyers know too they're just lying to say you're. violating people's civil rights so go to lawster. com backslash dlj you can read. the whole report 97 percent of the time what they said was false now would you. let anybody investigate anybody with that in their background so the. Trump administration is completely right by saying you're not touching this. you don't even know what grand b connor says it's clear they have no idea what.

Speaker 2 - Dr. Travis Yates:
legal force is and illegal force is they don't have any idea what justification. before they don't know anything because they put it in riding ship this isn't. just an opinion you can read what they wrote and you can clearly see. the bias is so extreme they cannot do any investigations and so if you're a. local agency the last thing you ever want to do is let the federal government. investigate your department they have proven time and time again. they're going to lie about you and it's crazy to me. that it's just kind of like me and a few people talking about this because to. me this is one of the biggest scandals in the last decade that one of the most. powerful law enforcement entities on the planet. has been deceptive and lied about local law enforcement. and really placed them in a really bad spot I mean. every city they've been involved in is turned into complete. crack holes. good stuff I can't wait to get back to it so guys. we'll be right back all right guys just tell them to talk about comply.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
technologies at Compliant Technologies dot com and they are committed to providing. non-lethal solutions to help officers gain the upper hand safely and rapidly. and what they call the humane law ethics manner utilizing their cd3. and that's there it's for conductive distraction and de-escalation device. technology now their flagship product we all know by now is called the club. it's not only helped officers tens of thousands of times but they've actually. had over 250 000 deployments and guess what no. injuries no deaths it's an amazing scat they've actually. achieved non-lethal status in an arena that predominantly can only offer. less-lethal results when it comes to weapons retention. transition to a sidearm or a conductive energy weapon the glove of comply. technologies dot com they are virtually eliminated weapons confusion. so stay ahead of the game with Compliant Technologies and the revolutionary cd3. the hundreds of agencies have already turned to nationwide and friends take. it from me when it comes to safety this is one of the most common sense hands-on. solutions that's ever come along so go to Compliant Technologies dot com. today tell them that chips at you again Compliant Technologies dot com. welcome back leo roundtable at leo roundtable dot com the law enforcement talk. show my name is chip the block and I'm your host for joined by dr travis. shates retired major from the Tulsa police department.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
also author of the courageous police leader and uh he's also at Travis Yates. dot org and you know he was just talking about. the doj and reminding us all that these attorneys for the doj. that are leaving in the minneapolis area because they're not comfortable with. you know doing the investigation against our care and then end up getting. killed that was attacking the you know the ice officer and stuff. uh you know you're you're giving us the insight of the doj that they've. always been part of the problem at least for recent memory anyhow. and we're really not losing they were kind of like purging a bad system is that. a good way to characterize that doctor yeah and something for everybody to. remember the law says it doesn't matter what you think. doesn't matter what you think watching a video in the confines of your home. doesn't mean no matter what doesn't mean what you think on twitter. what did the officer believe at the time this happened that's what the law says. and you could not like the law you can be mad about the law. but the fact is these type of incidents are not unique we're going to talk about. one of the later in this show these happen every week in law enforcement. just like this are very similar and nobody says a word so everyone that's. all up in arms over this is very disingenuous about it and they've just. brought emotion and politics to really gray up their mind so to speak so if.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
you had any sort of critical thinking skills you would sort of take a step. back and go what's there's this happening law enforcement well. I mean around 21 percent of the attacks on law enforcement that involve use of. deadly force involves a vehicle so you know that there's that. and the fact that we see these videos weekly chip here on the show. yeah there's that but people that are so embedded emotionally and. they have whatever the tds is with trump derangement syndrome they can't step. away from that and actually think about it and people know what's an up chip. if this thing was horrible we'd say it right we've said that plenty of times on. this show uh so it's unfortunate that you can't. think but uh that's what this show is about and hopefully other shows about. we're going to give you sort of right down the middle what sort of. uh you know what critical thinking what the law says what the constitution. says and you cannot like that but don't blame us blame the law. well thanks excellent point and I have a URL on the screen I know that we've got. a lot of uh you know radio listers or maybe podcasters they can't see the. screen but you mentioned the website to get more information about the DOJ. and just really how dishonest they are LawOfficer. com. slash DOJ is that correct uh doctor yeah I mean and I welcome anybody go. check it out and if you find something wrong. let me know to no one's found it yet because yeah they'll be the first they.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
said we took what they said and put it on paper and we compared to the. constitution is really all we did yeah it's not a it's it is not a when you. read that story and like I did like we explained when you read it's really. it's really not bad news after all guys hey uh moving along we're gonna jump to. a story where the first video component Rumble. com our favorite law enforcement. video channel called This Is Butter and look if you're looking for good. police videos to come out before anybody else has them. uh you know This Is Butter is at Rumble. com got had an issue with youtube like I did. and also actually LawOfficer. com has got him too. but baltimore maryland a man is in stable condition at a hospital after he was. shot by police while charging it officers with his. vehicle. throw. please. show your hand. It's in tight. move. Get up! Show me your hand! Show me your hand! Stop! Stop the car! Wow, another one. And they gave this announcement on Tuesday. So the shooting happened around 8.15 PM in the evening. They started off with an officer's response to the area. for there's some narcotics call. They kept the stop of car, the driver flees,. officers follow it through the city. and he makes a mistake, he goes down to dead end, right? That's the downside of driving on the area. not familiar with. Now he's in a dead end, he's got the cops behind him. What's he gonna do? So he stops the car.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
They get out, they're behind him. What's he doing? He puts him in reverse and then he charges. at the officers in reverse. Multiple officers fired their weapons into the car. Officers strike the driver, he's a 37 year old. He ends up being in a stable condition at the hospital. They don't give his name and I hunt it for it. And just kind of looking at my show notes,. I know that he stops the dead end,. shots are fired at three minutes and 16 seconds. on the video after he attempts to ram the officers once. And then he, well, he'd already attempted the ram on the ones. I didn't hear any shots being fired. This is the second attempt the ram officers. that they finally fire. And then in three minutes and 40 seconds,. he's been shot, but he's still moving around the vehicle,. but he backs the car up again. He looks like he's going to go forward again. But this time in forward and gear and drive changes his mind. The door opens up and he like crawls out and hits the ground. and they end up arresting him. So we got a couple of decent body-cameras of this incident. Dr. Yates. Yeah, I mean, just because it's timely,. you can look at this video in the one in Minneapolis. and it's actually very similar. The car backed up, the car went forward. The only difference is the officer. wasn't struck by this car. And this car was a good 15, 20 feet away from the officer. when he fired his weapon.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
Other than the other video where the car was right up on him. and it's trucking. So no one will say anything about this. It's to be legal, it'll be justified. Federal government, DOJ, everybody always. will say a word because if the politics aren't wrapped around. it, but these happen a lot, which if you're outraged. about Minneapolis, then you ought to be outraged about this one. But they won't be because people are being very disingenuous. in line about their opinion. Thank you. So right, so right. Even on LinkedIn, people weighing in,. well, how can you give a conclusive statement. by saying that it is justified in this? And people forget that. Look, we've got some great companies. and organizations like For Science. We're on Cleamsat and Jamie Borden with Critical Incident. Review and Danny King. But they don't enlist the services of these guys. on every police shooting around the country. Guess what? Agencies who work with the local DA or state attorney's. officer are able to determine an extremely short amount of time. whether or not it's a justified shoot. You've got your physical evidence,. but there's a lot of times to where you've. got to interview your witnesses and you're. going to interview your officer because really. what's important normally is what's. going to the officer's mind, right? I mean, is he really in fear? And if he is, what's the fear of? Or is it for himself or somebody else?

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
And would a reasonable officer do all that? But you can look at video evidence. And unless the officer opens up his mouth. and really screws things up and I'm going from my opinion,. you'll know most likely whether or not it's a justified shoot. But this is not stuff that takes weeks or months typically. I mean, there are other scenarios that. might be more complicated. You could have a MacDill Air Force Base here in Tampa. We had a guy that was trying to get away from cops. and breaching the Air Force Gate. And we had like an OK Corral shooting where we had like,. I don't know, dozens of officers shooting. And we had a dead guy. We had a crash gate at MacDill Air Force Base. And we had federal property. And it was just a mess. And a lot of players. But normally, these things are done very quickly. If you're going to go to the court,. and this guy's on trial for murder or homicide,. manslaughter, whatever, then it's. going to get down to the nitty-gree. with the forensic science portion of it. Your thoughts, Dr. Yates? Yeah. And you've heard a lot of talk this week about, oh,. because the officer said a cusp word afterwards. He had intent to do this. And then she did not have intent. And she did not have intent to run him over. OK, first off, are you sure that's what he said? Because if you're saying he said it,. it opens yourself a defamation lawsuit. And hint, there were a lot of officers on that scene.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
Don't be so sure he's the one that said it. Maybe we'll talk about that in a future show. Secondly, the law says intent doesn't matter on a suspect. or him. It doesn't matter what intent is. The law specifically says that in Graham v. Connor. The intent or motivation doesn't matter. because these are split-second decisions. and what the court said. So all this talk about intent, it doesn't matter,. which is why they can adjudicate these so quickly. as you said, Chip. Because if you had to understand what intent was. and what motive was, that takes a long time. if you ever get that. But the law says that intent doesn't matter. What matters is at that moment in time. was what the officer did objectively reasonable based. on the information he knew at that moment in time. Not what you find out later, not that you found out. that she had a stuffed doll in her car. or whatever it is, right? So once again, people that are crazy. don't want to think, they don't care about what I just said. But I think critically thinking people,. we'll want to go look at Graham v. Connor 1989,. read what it says, it's not rocket science. You'll see right then and there. why there's a lot of objectivity. when it comes to these incidents. You know, I know we're kind of going,. we're not really off topic,. but I'm talking a little bit longer about my LinkedIn posts. A lot of the people weighing in. that are passing judgment and bad judgment,.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
they don't like what I said or the video,. the guy, you know, it's not a justified shoot. They don't even live in this country. I remember last night, I'm on myself,. I'm driving my wife crazy. You just can't get away from it. I'm like, no, I lit, I mean, you know,. I run a news program. So, but it's some chicken Denmark. And so my only response was,. because I had already responded to like a dozen people already,. and I just brought her back. Thanks in advance for Greenland, you know, and, you know. Yeah, you know, I appreciate your tagging me on that LinkedIn post. because I saw. Oh, you're doing that. I saw. Oh, yeah, because people are responding to me. and they said, today some guy was like,. what about Trump? And I was like, I didn't even say it,. but I'm like, bro, you're supposed to be on Twitter. What are you doing, bring that over here? And that shows you their mindset, right? This has nothing to do with Minneapolis. This has to do with our hatred for president,. which is. Exactly. Always been very strange to me. I've had, we've had, I've had presidents. I didn't typically like,. but I didn't spend hours on my time talking crazy. about the president, right? I just voted a different way. So it's definitely a mental illness. I think we're seeing it with people acting that way. Well, yeah, and mental, that's a, you know,. and talking about mental illness in this country,.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
that is like a, that's like a whole day show. That may be interesting to talk about during shot show,. but hey, I'm gonna wet the appetite for the next story. with the video component, but it's all right with you, doctor. I know we got a commercial break coming up,. but also at LawOfficer. com. We have another story. It's got a video component. Please shoot a knife building suspect in St. Louis airport. And so. You got it. I don't know if you feel it. You don't feel it. Oh. Oh. Hey. Hey. Drop. I'm out of this. This is here. Drop. Drop the knife. Drop. Drop the knife. Drop. Drop the knife. Drop it. Drop it. Drop it. Drop it. Drop. Let's go. Grab the knife. Drop it. Drum roll. for. in Missouri all of a sudden. Now we've got a commercial break coming up, so let me just. wet the appetite. This happened recently, guys. This is November the 21st, and it's. a situation where obviously a little nervous about crossfire with the moving subjects surrounded. by officers. So we're going to talk about that in just one second. Stick with us and. be right back. Alright guys, it's time to talk about gunlearn at GunLearn. com. And hey,. they're having some changes with gunlearn. So if you haven't heard lately, you may want. to pay attention, you know, and gunlearn for starters, they're the first and they're. the only company that offers a step-by-step program that takes you from your present knowledge.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
level, become a safe, accurate, and competent certified firearm specialist. Now, there's. certification we're talking about. Even if you got it five years ago, now it's worth. college credits. Why is because GunLearn. com, they partnered with smarter degree in their. university partners in order to pull that off. So again, that certified firearm specialist. degree, now it's worth college credits. And they've been doing the specs. It's 1996,. competition, everything that Leo's, which is law enforcement officers, neither know. about firearms and ammunition to all factions of law enforcement. Now, you can actually start. today with online training or you can sign up to attend a live seminar and you can even. get free training for yourself and all the personnel, your agency by hosting a seminar. for absolutely no cost. Go to GunLearn. com to get more information GunLearn. com. Welcome. back. Leo Roundtable at LEORoundtable. com. My name is Chip DeBlock and I'm your host. for joined by Dr. Travis Yates, retired Tulsa Police Department major and also author of the courageous. police leader. You know, we've got, we're at the St. Louis airport right now in Missouri. And I don't mean physically. I mean, story wise, on November the 21st, 2025, we've got. a recently released video and this is at LawOfficer. com. If you guys want to read the. story and watch the video. And so St. Louis airport police are doing foot patrols in terminal.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
one. And there's this adult dude there named Darius Kennedy and he's outside the restroom. And officers instruct him to leave the airport and he refuses to comply. So look, the first. flag noncompliant, right? He refuses to follow the officers commands and he pulls out a knife. from the sleeve of his jacket. That's the second problem, right? So officers that issue multiple. verbal commands to this guy instructing him now to drop the knife. Of course, he ignores. commands and now he starts to move forward towards the officers. Now the officers, I. will tell you the credit create a visual picture for the people like a word picture. They have surrounded this dude. And we've got, let me go to my show notes. I think I count. it for, I think I count it for officers. Oh, okay, yeah, there's at least four officers. You can see four officers in the video surrounding this guy. So now he's coming at these guys. with the knife. And so you've got one officer deploys a taser and he actually hits the bad. guy Kennedy, but it's not effective. He's still armed. And now he turns and he runs. in the direction of another police officer that officer fires a service weapon and he. hits the bad guy who's pronounced dead at the scene. The investigation later determined. that Kennedy was 31 years old and that he was on the house. So he was, you know, trans. and I'm just looking here at my show notes. We got a couple, actually we got a couple.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
body-camera videos of this in a surveillance video as well that show this. But you know,. I don't know about you, doctor, but I was watching the video and I'm watching where. everybody is and I'm watching the backdrop and it was just making me really nervous. Yeah, you know, I get pretty angry when I go to St. Louis airport, I fly through there a lot. because unless you're an alcoholic, there's nothing to eat at that airport. They just have. bars. They don't have many restaurants. And I'm usually flying through there late at night on a. flight. But I would never think about doing this. Well, as you talked about, I would. never normally say that a TASER played a row in a man with a knife. And you know, I'm on the show. all the time going, what are we doing? Like these things don't work very much. And, or they don't. work very much not if they don't if they're not used appropriately, but we use them on everything. But this case, I will actually say it was pretty clear that the officers had a plan because one. officer was completely on TASER and the other officer was completely on lethal force. And so,. as soon as the TASER didn't work, lethal force kicked in. And so I would say this was an okay. deployment by that. But they had to have known long before that he attacked them, which is what. he was doing, trying to run towards them that this is going to happen. And this is the biggest thing.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
And as you know, Chip, I talked about this a lot. I'm involved in this thing called focus training,. field observable cues for unknown situations where we have gone back and we have used research and. science to look at what occurs prior to violent attacks. And one of the most common is what we. call a declaration verbally doesn't happen every time, but it happens pretty quite calmly. But when. it happens, you got to get ready verbally. They say something that makes you think that doesn't. make sense. And so when the guy immediately tells him, you're gonna have to kill me tonight,. that should have that's a huge red flag. So it was not a shock to me that once he said that,. he then started not complying. Then he started target fixation. He started turning, he started. looking at each officer. So you have to know in that moment, it's happening. There's no more talking. to this guy. There's no more target deescalate. He's already made up his mind. And because when. you get to verbally saying something, you have already made up your mind. And so he was just. trying to find the right time. And so I would say they were pretty keen on that. They didn't let. him get too far down the line. Obviously, it's in an airport, he starts running around a bunch of. officers around very fortunate. But I thought overall, they handled it pretty well. All right, all right, very good. Yeah, at least, you know, only the bad guy got hurt on this one.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
So good deal. And I will say, you know, it's an airport, it's a terminal one, right? But. I didn't see, I didn't see a civilian around period. They did a really good job of they must have. blocked it off. Yeah, I think that's what they happened because they just didn't show. up with one on TASER, one on less-lethal. And that they without talking about it. I think. they probably had a plan. They cleared it out. I've got to think it wasn't past security because. he had a knife, but hey, it's TSA. So you never know. But yeah, I think overall, the reason they. were successful in that is they were there was good planning, which if you have time to plan. on these situations, it's always the best thing to do. You don't always have time. But if you do,. it's great. Yeah, right. Good point. Good point. Because as it would have been the. same Francisco, he would have grabbed a female right next to him and held her hostage. And, you know,. remember that one where they actually were able to. Yeah. Anyhow, moving on. Look, your choice,. Dr. Yates, I'm going to give you two choices if you don't mind. So we've got our officer that. gets reinstated and he gets his license back. And it is, let me think, I believe that, I believe. that might be is that Albuquerque or that is another Austin, Texas. So that was the officer. He ends up getting to get acquitted and he gets his license back. And we've got the other one.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
where we have our black female lieutenant that is a trooper, her and all the other female. troopers that are being so nice. This guy, the dim and the warm blanket, it's raining outside. and stuff. And then he turns any rips are out of the car. And he stills are. cruisers. We've already covered that once. Now we just have body-camera. So we've already covered. it. But we'll we would cover it again. But we got a little less than four minutes. We have to cover. that one. Right. The body-cameraera was just to get right. All right. So rumble. com. This is. butter. Is the name of the channel body-camera video shows a man throwing in Washington State trooper. to the ground and then stealing her patrol car. Yeah, you are. Please. What? No. Sorry. Get proof of time to the soldier. I told her. time. But alets die. wasRolled to have. sis lane. vehicles, woman. So. far. 45 United. school of. He's still my patrol car. He's still my patrol car. He's still my patrol car. After 1-84th and lane 1, or a recent he's got a... Soon zero. So I'll be secondary behind 2-65. I'll be calling it. We're continuing southbound,. Aldewood Mall Parkway, approaching Beach Road,. speed 61 miles an hour. We're making a right turn now. Aldewood Mall Boulevard from Aldewood Mall Parkway. Right down to Aldewood Mall Boulevard, where are we going? We're going to go over to the front. So I'll be primary and I'm going to try to go for a Pimby Bay.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
a right-hand turn. We're going southbound 44th Avenue West,. getting back onto the southbound Interstate 5 right now. I'll be right back. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He just starts me going to something again. We're still southbound. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so, yeah, so, yeah, Washington State Patrol. We've already covered it once. I'm going to go very quickly. Our bad guy 24 year old, Alexander Eugene Smith told investigators that he smoked meth. before the incident. So it shows troopers talking to him. And look, these are all like all, there was one dude. I don't know if it was a dude. There was one that was questioned. I don't know if it was a dude or a chick, but you know, but it was other than that,. it was most certainly all females talking and dealing with this guy. And then he ends up walking down the center lanes of Interstate 5 near 85th Street. And no one's forcing him to get off the freaking interstate. I just couldn't believe how just like, not lackadaisical, but just, you know, we don't. want to offend them. We don't want to force him. Give him a blanket. Yeah. Oh, let's do this. Oh, my goodness. So sure enough, eventually this guy bolts across the interstate and now she leaves her. car and she's, you know, she's out on the radio and there's only people coming or like. other females. And then sure enough, the, you know, he grabs the lieutenant. Well, he says, as you walk in and crosses all lanes of Interstate 5 and the lieutenant approaches.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
Smith tells him to stop. He violently pulls her from the patrol car, gets in the driver's seat. And then she's knocking on the door because his lock from the inside, he won't open and. then he speeds off. So she stops a driver and asks them the call 911. Dude, what's up with that? Do that have like portable freaking radios? Or is it just one in the car like in the old days? And then they chase the stolen car and they end up doing a pit on it, which was just like. heavy damage to that thing. And they pull the bad guy from the car and arrest him. Dr. Yates. Yeah, this is something, this is a video everybody has to see. And unfortunately, I think people are making a big deal about being females. And I've worked with plenty of females that would take care of business. I mean, so this wasn't one of them. This wasn't one of them. And so she, and if you haven't seen the video, like literally this dude just takes one hand. and just throws her out of the car and then gets off and drives off. But the best part of the video is after he drives off, she starts going, no,. no, right, no. And then another officer pulls up and not that she's got enough shame about what happened. She couldn't set in the passenger seat because there's a bunch of stuff there. She's got to get in the back seat of the police car to go chase this guy with this in this. other officer. So yeah, she's probably not going to be able to live that one down without a few cartoons.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
and a few memes. But hopefully we learn from it, right? There's a time to be nice and there's time not to be nice. And this guy had given them no indication it was a time to be nice. I mean, so it seems pretty ludicrous. We were even in that position to begin with. Yeah. I'm saying that there's no place for females on long force, but I'm just saying don't. stack the deck with female officers on your department because things like this are going. to happen. You know, I saw three or four troopers and they all look like they were female to me. And I'm just saying, I mean, the, I mean, what is the, what is that ratio? I mean, you know, they're trying to get, there's that movement that trying to get to what? 33% of long fortune officers being females on every department that just you don't, you. don't hire, you hire people based on ability, not to fill a freaking stat. They're only asking for trouble and you deserve what you get. But you know, when I see all these troopers showing up this scene, finally, when they. had to ram the car, there were male officers that showed up. But when you, when you've got a guy that ended up smoking meth and you've only got females. there. And even if there's three, they're not going to be able to handle this guy. You know, that is a safety concern for me. So I just, I just, you know, it became just very apparent watching the video. I don't mind there being a female trooper there, but at least, you know, when you're.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
dealing with people and then just call them the sky, not taking action. Probably because they didn't feel like they, I have to assume maybe they questioned whether. they could take law enforcement action and go hands on with this guy because no one wanted. to, you know, so I'm not going to let the guy walk. If he doesn't want to get the interstate, you're, I'm going to arrest you for trick,. freaking trespassing and, you know, on state property and boom, you're gone. You know, and it just takes people off the street. You know, they're falling, what they look like they were falling for like miles down. the interstate as you feel like. It would be a great, it'd be a great conversation for another show to ask whether as soon as. he got in the car and drove off, was that a deadly forced situation. Can't get to it today, but that'd be a great conversation on a future show. Yeah, you're right. You're right. Yeah, I'm curious what she had in that car too. You know, we knew she probably had a radio in there because she couldn't because she had. to ask us a billion. Well, if it's like the majority of police cars, you've got weapons in the car and the car. and the cars are weapon. They are, you know, whatever shotgun. Yeah. All right. The one to blue, the One2Blue. org. Check that out and I support them monthly. Great organization guys. Please support our sponsors also. They go to the great links that bring the show to you.

Speaker 1 - Chip DeBlock (Sponsor Read):
We've got our title sponsor, Galls at Galls. com. Don't forget that discount code, Radio 15, CompliantTechnologies. com, GunLearn. com, my. Medicare dot live, Tobellas. com. Thanks for watching. We'll see you back tomorrow at 12 noon Eastern.